Modelling water in Sketchup

[Lishy]

Hey guys. I'm trying to create a dungeon for JSA in Sketchup. However, I'm confused about water. How exactly am I supposed to model into my model?

 

Do I simply make a flat surface representing water above the intended environment, or what?

 

What about rapids/water flows and making small Waterfalls like Zora RIver's?

 

And water-temple styled water levels?

 

He told me that Jason777 knows how to animate it, but "no one mapped out water currents". I'm just sorta confused here about what I'm supposed to do while I'm modelling this?

[SanguinettiMods]

1) I don't think there needs to be a separate topic for each of these questions. They can be answered simply in one combined topic, or in the shoutbox.

2) Water is simply a collisionless mesh with a waterbox, that you can add in SharpOcarina, under it. The waterfall from Zora's river is an actor. Rapids are animating textures. z64-tex-ext, a hack spinout created, can be used to animate textures. So, water is a flat surface.

[Lishy]

2) Water is simply a collisionless mesh with a waterbox, that you can add in SharpOcarina, under it. The waterfall from Zora's river is an actor. Rapids are animating textures. z64-tex-ext, a hack spinout created, can be used to animate textures. So, water is a flat surface.

 

What about the small waterfalls? The ones at the beginning of the map, and NOT the end! Is that an actor too?

 

So would I just model the water as normal in sketchup? Is there a particular Opaque level I give it so that it will be consistent with OoT?

[SanguinettiMods]

That's just a flat surface, too. An arc. In SharpOcarina, make the Display List's alpha about 130.

[Lishy]

That's just a flat surface, too. An arc. In SharpOcarina, make the Display List's alpha about 130.

 

Do small waterfalls use the same texture as water? Do I stretch the texture?

 

Also, am I not supposed to make a texture with decreased opaque in sketchup?

[xdaniel]

SharpOcarina ignores most material settings because of my shitty planning (for example, I didn't realize .obj materials support ex. translucency). Make your water a separate group, then apply alpha of around 130 to it in SO, as Sanguinetti said.

[Lishy]

By making a group, you mean in Sketchup? How do I create a group then? Slightly related, but I'll have to work with a LOT of transparencies in my Crystal Palace dungeon to make the "reflections".

 

While making it, I should keep the intended areas translucent, but then set them in SharpOcarina?

[Jason777]

Animating textures is a bit tricky to understand. I would recommend studying the folder "hacks" in z64-tex-ext to be able to comprehend what must be done.

 

In case you're wondering, you don't have to worry about the "run_code" or "hook" folder-- they're the actual modification of the engine. The "hack" folder is the actual texture animation process concerning the map. By the way, you can do a lot more than just do a scrolling animation; spinout only included that as an example hack. With enough experience and knowledge, you could do whatever you wanted with the texture.

 

Getting it to compile is pretty simple after modifying the Makefile and an included build script.

 

P.S. I've been trying to write a detailed tutorial on how to get it implemented with a map but there's just so much that I would have to cover that it's kind of overwhelming. Ask Sanguinetti, I taught him how to make and compile a very basic hack in C and that took forever.

[Lishy]

Ok. But how do I do the small waterfall in sketchup? Should I stretch the texture, or what? :S

 

Also, offtopic, but I'm having trouble making ice cavern walls...

 

http://images.wikia..../Ice_Cavern.png

 

I can't seem to find any texture resembling the walls! Searched the entire rip of the dungeon, but seriously. What the heck is that?

 

Also, if I want to make the icicle stalactites, what proportions do I make it so that it is consistent?

 

Also, the crystals?

http://www.matwolf.c...lda-ocarina.jpg

I noticed there is a peculiar 16x16 blue texture.. I guess I must stretch that?

 

But what about that floor in the room as well?

[SanguinettiMods]

*cough*

http://www.the-gcn.com/topic/1203-oot-and-mm-complete-mapscene-texture-rip/

[Arcaith]

There's a fairly good chance that the texture used may be white and is tinted blue by its blendmode, so do be prepared for that possibility.

[Lishy]

*cough*

http://www.the-gcn.c...ne-texture-rip/

 

I have the rip, and I am using it.

 

Which one do I use for each?

 

I know this is the "snow" floor at the absolute beginning:

 

And the transition:

 

However, notice the wall version of the texture is more bluish?

 

 

If you notice the walls, they appear to be a different texture. But what?

 

Here it seems to be the same texture, deeper into the cavern:

http://images.wikia..../Ice_Cavern.png

 

Some candidates?

 

And the16x16 texture:

 

This looks like red ice?

 

Anyways, check the floors here:

 

What the heck texture is that!?

 

Also:

 

See the iceblock? What do I do to remake its sides?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v626/pokeman/texture_0x020100C0_fmt0x10.png

Seems it uses that texture, but it's whiter near the top?

[SanguinettiMods]

All I did was rip the textures. I can't identify each and every one for you. The Ice Block isn't part of the Map. It's an actor in itself, so with this rip, you won't find the Ice Block's textures. Nor the Red Ice texture, as you though above.

[Lishy]

Hrm.. Seems is used with some color translation and placed ontop of the snow to create the effect from here:

 

Still.. The walls.. Hrm...

 

Also, when modelling in sketchup, is it really necessary to place everything 1" above the floors and walls? Can I possibly "combine" the textures or something, like OoT appears to do?

[SanguinettiMods]

That's possible with SharpOcarina's Multitexturing ability. The walls in that room are this texture: http://imagebin.org/209213

[Lishy]

That's possible with SharpOcarina's Multitexturing ability. The walls in that room are this texture: http://imagebin.org/209213

 

Yup. But I meant snowy walls like this:

http://images.wikia.com/zelda/images/c/c8/Ice_Cavern.png

 

 

If I use the multitexturing ability however, is there still any way to set up the multi-textures visually in sketchup?

[SanguinettiMods]

I have no idea. That'd be something to ask xdaniel. Those walls are probably something like IC-0x20E50_32x64_RGBA16.png

[Lishy]

I have no idea. That'd be something to ask xdaniel. Those walls are probably something like IC-0x20E50_32x64_RGBA16.png

 

My filenames are formatted a little differently, so I'm not sure what you're referring to!

[xdaniel]

Multi-texturing is rather limited and all done inside SO, one reason being that (as far as I know) the Wavefront .obj format doesn't support any kind of multi-texturing. There's a post about how it works somewhere in the SharpOcarina thread, currently somewhere near the end I assume, and the Readme should have some notes about it as well.

 

Also - which cannot be done using SO, but I'll mention it for completeness sake - color tinting and such may also be done using vertex colors. That's especially common in dungeons in the original game, but isn't supported in SO because 1) .obj files do not support vertex colors and 2) manually editing each vertex in SO would be a pain to code support for and to actually use.

[Jason777]

The texture that Sanguinetti is referring to is the 32x64 16-bit RGBA located at 0x20E50 in Ice Cavern's ZMAP. I'm only assuming, though...

 

And I put this on the shoutbox, but... Admins, would it be okay if I submitted a video tutorial on how to use z64-tex-ext to manipulate textures? It would most likely be a three part tutorial:

• Get MinGW compiler, get the python compiler/interpreter, set up the $PATH variable, get N64 toolchain (the one I am using). Explain stuff about the compiler and extra tools.
• Get z64-tex-ext hack. Modify the makefile and include paths. Teach you how to compile the hack and explain stuff about certain files.
• Teach you how to use the actual hack to be implemented in custom maps. This'll probably take the longest and require the most concentration.

[Lishy]

The texture that Sanguinetti is referring to is the 32x64 16-bit RGBA located at 0x20E50 in Ice Cavern's ZMAP. I'm only assuming, though...

 

And I put this on the shoutbox, but... Admins, would it be okay if I submitted a video tutorial on how to use z64-tex-ext to manipulate textures? It would most likely be a three part tutorial:

• Get MinGW compiler, set up $PATH variable, get N64 toolchain (the one I am using). Explain stuff about the compiler and extra tools.
• Get z64-tex-ext hack. Modify the makefile and include paths. Teach you how to compile the hack and explain stuff about certain files.
• Teach you how to use the actual hack to be implemented in custom maps. This'll probably take the longest and most concentration.

If you do that, please make a thread or pm me notifying when it's done!

 

Also, really don't know which texture he means!

 

Multi-texturing is rather limited and all done inside SO, one reason being that (as far as I know) the Wavefront .obj format doesn't support any kind of multi-texturing. There's a post about how it works somewhere in the SharpOcarina thread, currently somewhere near the end I assume, and the Readme should have some notes about it as well.

 

Also - which cannot be done using SO, but I'll mention it for completeness sake - color tinting and such may also be done using vertex colors. That's especially common in dungeons in the original game, but isn't supported in SO because 1) .obj files do not support vertex colors and 2) manually editing each vertex in SO would be a pain to code support for and to actually use.

 

For tinting, can't I use sketchup's tinting as a substitute?

 

Also, considering I'm modelling this all before touching Sharpocarina, still kinda confused about this.. Tips? Are you saying I should go with a basic model for now, and worry about multi-texturing later when I import it? My concern at the moment is how to make it in sketchup...

[SanguinettiMods]

I'm talking about this image: http://imagebin.org/209226

 

The file name of the image is what I was talking about.

[Secant]

And I put this on the shoutbox, but... Admins, would it be okay if I submitted a video tutorial on how to use z64-tex-ext to manipulate textures? It would most likely be a three part tutorial:

1. Get MinGW compiler, get the python compiler/interpreter, set up the $PATH variable, get N64 toolchain (the one I am using). Explain stuff about the compiler and extra tools.
   
2. Get z64-tex-ext hack. Modify the makefile and include paths. Teach you how to compile the hack and explain stuff about certain files.
   
3. Teach you how to use the actual hack to be implemented in custom maps. This'll probably take the longest and most concentration.
   

 

Knock yourself out; the Tutorials section is there for a reason, and anyone is welcomed (and encouraged!) to post their guides freely.

 

For tinting, can't I use sketchup's tinting as a substitute?

 

Two problems. First, different tintings of the texture result in two separate textures being exported, which isn't particularly efficient. Secondly, SketchUp's tinter is rather poor in quality, so it won't look nearly as good as if you colorized the texture yourself in GIMP/Photoshop/whatever or figured out how to do vertex coloring yourself.

[Lishy]

I'm talking about this image: http://imagebin.org/.....<br /><br />The file name of the image is what I was talking about.

 

Aight, so I use

 

And multi-texture it with

 

?

 

But it cannot be patterned though due to the blue/white gradient of the wall texture? Only stretched? Sure it's that texture?

 

I do not see the resemblance.

http://images.wikia.com/zelda/images/c/c8/Ice_Cavern.png

 

Also, what of this?

[SanguinettiMods]

I'm not sure. I was just looking based off of that. I have no idea.

[SanguinettiMods]

It may not look like it, but I did a VRML Export from Nemu just to figure this out, and the tetxure that wall uses is http://img.photobuck...0C0_fmt0x10.png

 

And for the record, this is how Nintendo did those "small waterfalls":http://imagebin.org/209245