Grand visions getting in the way...

[xdaniel]

Not sure how applicable this is to everyday life, but have you ever had some grand visions or plans for something get in the way of actually getting it done?

 

(And a warning, my take on this - in the spoiler - will sound whiny and possibly arrogant...)

 

 

For me, this has been a problem over the last few months or so, in particular regarding programming. With everything I'm thinking of writing, I'd like to make it modular, clean, reusable, easy to use, etc... however, nothing I've done so far, where I tried to apply those ideas, has come anywhere near being a working piece of software. The closest is probably Sorata, and in turn the rendering library Nanami, but those (Sorata itself in particular) are still far from actually doing what they're supposed to be, or becoming what they're supposed to become...

 

And disregarding the style of code - which is where the "grand visions" come into play - and especially considering hacking OoT/MM, I've been trying to make tools that do everything, to make it easier on the casual end user. Especially the latter is something very important we'll need to do. At the same time, tho, both things are something I can't seem to do right. An all-encompassing scene and actor editor, meaning Sorata - not gonna be finished for a long time, and somewhere on the road to being a complete mess. An easy to use replacement for SharpOcarina... "Labyrinth" - which is currently mainly a GUI with some supporting code designed to eventually abstract low-level stuff like header commands from the user, and also far, far away from even being usable.

 

I fear that none of this stuff will ever work out. Also... and this will, as mentioned above, likely sound quite arrogant or somesuch... I seem to be among the only ones actually willing to try and program stuff. Really, I don't want to diminish the efforts of everyone else who does know how to code and such, but I'm ex. pretty much one of three or so people to have ever created a level editor for OoT - and hell, I've made at least two alone...

 

...ugh, yeah... rant done. Again, this likely sounded very whiny and that last paragraph in particular rather arrogant... so I apologize to everyone I might've offended.

 

 

[zaneebaslave]

This is exactly how I am 100% of the time. My mind is filled to the BRIM with ideas for things like games, comic books, art, music, and other things. The only problem is that whenever I actually START the project, it's either not to my liking, or I come up with ANOTHER Idea that takes over my concentration. It's mind-numbing and annoying. Unfortunately for me, is that I have never gotten a project done. Out of the thousands I've come up with, none of them have been finished, most of them never even see the light if day. But if I COULD finish a project, it would be fantastic!

[Secant]

To address your initial disclaimer, considering you've actually walked the talk and you're doing little more than pointing out facts about how many people take up programming tools for hacking Zelda, I don't think you come off as arrogant by voicing your concerns.

 

With that said, I think one of the biggest reasons so few people are willing to delve into the work you do is because it involves more or less teaching oneself not only programming, but how to work with an unfamiliar system like a closed-source video game engine. True, we have an enormous amount of documentation available, but it's not as useful to people totally new to this sort of thing, which most people here are. For one, programming is a very difficult field to delve into; a good number of people struggle even in university environments with learning basic concepts of programming, never mind left to their own devices in trying to figure it out from tutorials on the internet. Combined with the required understand of the file formats for the game and how to work with it, I can't say I'm surprised so few people take up this kind of thing; it quickly becomes a nearly insurmountable task to the casual user here to even attempt to create even the most basic of tools. So if anything--and I'm sure it doesn't sound very helpful, but I'm tossing it out there because it really should be said--people like you, DeathBasket, spinout, sakura, Jason777 and haddockd really deserve a lot of praise for all you've given the community; it's because of the tools you've made that any of the mods people have so much as started have come as far as they have. And if it's any consolation, even if, by your insistence, SharpOcarina is a mess, it still sees a massive amount of use for anyone who wants to import custom maps.

 

Regarding your overarching concern, then, about grand visions impeding your progress, I think the best thing I can recommend is take as much time as possible to plan out a tool and figure out exactly what you want it to do, and stick to it. When you're figuring out that purpose, too, make sure it's something you can feasibly do--or if you don't have the ability to yet, that it isn't pushing your limits too far. This boils down more to an understand of yourself and what you're capable of, and seeing what you've done so far, that's clearly quite a lot, but anyone can get bogged down in the intricacies of an overly complex project, and let's face it--you're just one person, and one person can only do so much. Keep that in mind whenever you're working on a project, and, again, structure the design of the program as carefully as you can so that it does what you want it to do, and it actually gets done. Don't be afraid to start small; once you finish the main overall purpose of the program, there's nothing stopping you from adding on small features to it as you go, and most of all, don't be afraid to take a break once you finish; a job well done is exactly that, and deserving of a chance to rest from accomplishing your goal.

 

tl;dr you're awesome and don't be discouraged

[EpicEbilninja]

With me, I'm trying to make a full length(or atleast a long length) fangame with next to no knowledge of how to program, create sprites, or generate a decent storyline. I think it's time I figure out how to these things before I mess up the entire wario and waluigi rpg(again).

[DeathBasket]

I know what you're getting at. With regards to my project work for my degree, I've put so much time into thinking what could be included in it or possible things I could also study to be able to better interpret the results that I'm sort of forgetting this is just an undergraduate project and that I don't need to be doing a load more than I already have to get the grade I'm going for. At the same time, I could have been writing up the final report on my project but I have got so sidetracked by the unnecessary stuff that I now feel I might struggle to get it done in time. I've sort of disappointed myself with this because I know that despite the quality of the work I've done (which my supervisor has given me a fair bit of praise for), a bad report will spoil my overall grade.

 

Applying this to Zelda hacking? Well, I've been out of the loop for so long that I'm not really sure what's what right now. I do know that a lot of people seem to have very high expectations for all tools released yet the majority don't get involved in helping to figure things out that would help with development. Then there's always the 'joint community effort' tool that gets mentioned now and then but never happens. I understand that for most people they probably don't have either the time, knowledge or motivation to get involved; I know that I personally lack all three depending on the case (I wouldn't have the first idea about how to make anything other than a text-based level editor, for example). I'd even be reluctant to get involved in helping to program things just because I am not a programmer by trade and my programming skills are not good so it may seem to a more advanced programmer that I'm doing things badly which would make me feel as if I were not helping.

Anyway, not really sure where I'm going with this so I'll just stop it here.

[Gump]

I fear that none of this stuff will ever work out. Also... and this will, as mentioned above, likely sound quite arrogant or somesuch... I seem to be among the only ones actually willing to try and program stuff. Really, I don't want to diminish the efforts of everyone else who does know how to code and such, but I'm ex. pretty much one of three or so people to have ever created a level editor for OoT - and hell, I've made at least two alone...

 

This may not be so true in the upcoming future.

>.>

<.<

[Mallos31]

xdan, you are an amazing programmer. I'm trying to get somewhere with programming myself, and you inspire me. And really, I feel exactly the same way all the time. I don't know enough, so I get frustrated. I have been TRYING to get things in the works. I want to be at your level, or even at a level capable of making SOMETHING useful. But I'm not. Honestly, I look up to you, and I don't see a word you said as arrogance. If you were arrogant, you'd deserve to be. You've done more for this community than I can even remember. But believe me when I say, you, and every other artist, programmer, writer, whatever feels the same way. Just keep at it bro, and you'll get where you want to go. I have a lot of faith in you and your work. Thanks for everything you've done.